"G4 PCI bus problems...
Posted By: DJS
Date: Saturday, 4 March 2000, at 6:10 p.m.

I work in audio, and a lot of us have been plagued with PCI bus 'too busy' errors since the Sawtooth motherboards began shipping. This problem seems to be the worst when trying to run with 2 ProTools Mix cards and a second display card in the final slot. The problem is so bad that it causes system crashes after about 20-30 minutes of ProTools operation.

The official word from Digidesign as of this week is that the problem is "...beyond the scope of our resolve."

I'd like to know if any of you have had similar problems when using Sawtooth G4's with other hardware/software, i.e. professionals using G4's for digital video production, graphics, CAD, etc. If so, has anyone found a way to sidestep this problem? In what specific situations/conditions do you incur these errors? Also, if anyone has a PCI expansion chassis and has found a way to use a second display either in the chassis or on the Sawtooth motherboard, then do tell. "

Comments are welcome and I wonder if the Yikes G4 (PCI)/B&W G3 motherboards report the same problem with dual Protools Mix cards and a similar setup. Please include your system model and configuration details.

Plus40 Maxtor in Beige G3 Results: I've posted a page of benchmark test results in a Beige G3/333 with the Maxtor 40GB drive. As I noted in my original review of the drive (tested in a B&W G3), the Beige G3's ATA/3 onboard IDE controller (appx 16MB/sec max interface limit) really limits the drive's performance. Thanks to Chad Mathes for sending the test results which include comparisons to the original Beige G3 UW SCSI 9.1GB drive (Chad's Beige G3 had the SCSI card & disk option).

It's horribly late, but I'm working on a page of IDE RAID results, including a reader's test with single and dual IDE cards with up to 4 Seagate Barracuda IDE drives. There's been so many things going on the last two weeks I have not been able to get the article finished yet.

Pismo Batteries - $69.95 Delivered: Outpost.com has batteries that fit the Pismo for $69.95 including free shipping. Search for '54768' (the item number) to find them. The Lombard batteries are the same model number as the Pismo ones and work perfectly (verified).

G4 Stepping 2.9 Now Shipping? A reader from Toronto writes his new G4 system had a v2.9 CPU:

"Greetings from Toronto Mike,

I purchased a new G4/400 yesterday and Gauge Pro indicates that it has a version 2.9 7400.
Steve"

Gauge Pro is available for free from Newer Tech's software download page. I've used it in my G4 CPU upgrade reviews in the past.

Software Updates: (Courtesy Barney Buoy)

• Startup Doubler2.5.3
• OS X Web Browser (OmniWeb 4.0 beta 1)

Warning on Using Password Security Control Panel on Pismo: Although the PB Security Control Panel incompatibilty is mentioned in Apple's recent PowerBook Firewire Late Breaking News (down at the bottom under 'Documentation changes') there's no warning on what the dangers are of using it. A reader sent a warning to anyone attempting to use the Security Control Panel on the new Powerbooks:

"Mike,
There is a serious situation your readers should know about. Previous Powebooks before the Pismo had a Password Security control panel installed but NOT on the Pismos, reason being if used on the Pismos it will hose your hard drive and it will have to be swapped out. As unbelievable as it sounds it is true, came straight from a high level tech guy at Apple.

A Pismo owner dragged this control panel from an older Powerbook and fried his drive...

Please let your readers know.
Thanks
John "

Hindsight is always 20/20 but considering the risks I think Apple should post a caution or warning instead of the current comment at the bottom of the Late Breaking News TIL:

"Documentation changes

Password Security control panel - The Password Security control panel mentioned in Mac Help was designed to work with older PowerBook computers and is not installed on your PowerBook."

A warning added to the above would likely have prevented anyone from attempting to use the CP If everyone read the TIL or the included link to 'Breaking News' in the root of the Pismo Hard Drive. (Breaking news link requires a Net connection of course.)

Newer Tech Updates G3 Control Software: Newer Tech's CPU upgrade software for PDS and non-PDS cards have been updated for OS 9 compatibility. Get the latest version at Newer Tech's drivers page. (Scroll down the page to see the latest versions.)

More on Fan/Fanless Rage128 Pro AGP Cards: The latest comments on the new Fanless Rage128 Pro AGP cards in the new G4s (first noted here last week by Ed Lai on his 2/23/2000 built G4).

"Hi Mike,
I just wanted to follow up my posting (as "voltaire") in the G4 forum (The "contra Lai--I have a fan (dang it!)" thread of Feb 28). I got in touch with Mr. Lai, and he kindly supplied me with the part number (065-2100) of his Rage card. As it turns out, this is the same number for the card I have, so I'm not sure how they make the distinction between fanless and fanned cards (unless Mr. Lai's is an anomaly). In any case, I called Apple, and they're going to replace the card via an on-site repair. They said they've been collecting loud cards since the issue turned up and have been trying to isolate the problem. They even admitted that replacement cards have in some cases not been satisfactory. Well, it will be interesting to see if my replacement card has a fan.
Paul Montelone"

As I noted in the main site news, I suspect this is a transition period where like the first Rev 2 B&W G3s last spring/summer, there was mixed stock in the supply chain.

L2G3 Upgrade/Gaming Freeze Tip: A reader sends a tip for those having problems with games and a L2G3 upgrade. (Note that disabling the Sound Manager also was reported to solve game problems on all Macs some time back when the SM updates were released)

"Hi Mike,
...I have a suggestion for eliminating problems with a Sonnet Crescendo L2/G3 upgraded computer. I have a Performa 6400 that I recently upgraded. I have a Creative Voodoo2 for 3D (I have an ixmicro Ult. Rez for 2D). When I upgraded to the G3 card I experienced intermittent freezes in Unreal (any version). I read that similar problems were occurring with the Sonnet card and ATI video cards.

Someone resolved the problem by disabling the sound manager extension (ver. 2.6). So I tried it. Guess what, no more freezes. This isn't exactly scientific, but it works. Maybe some type of conflict with the sound manager extension and the Crescendo extension? Don't know but it works like a champ....
Have a good one,
Dave"

OS X DP3 Install on Umax S900: A reader sent a note the OS X install guide at http://members.home.com/davidjclark/clonekernelhack.html worked with OS X DP3 on his S900, and sent a few tips to supplement David's guide:

"I would just like to say thank you to David Clark for posting the instructions on his website. I have tried to clarify a few points that got a little confusing during the installation process. The text following ****** are my comments or tips that can be used to perform the installation.

Here are the specs on the machines used to pull this off:
S900 - 400/200 Overclocked to 440/220 mhz OWC ZIF, XLR8 Carrier ZIF card, 216 MB RAM, ATI Rage Orion video, OS9.

Supported machine - PowerbookG3 250mhz (wallstreet) connected externally to my S900 2 GB SCSI HD through the use of the original MAC CD-ROM drive (plugged 50 pin and power connectors into my S900 internal HD)

You start to get the feeling of being mad scientist when doing this but it is quite rewarding to see OS X DP3 running on your non-apple branded hardware. I would imagine that when the final release comes out that someone will develop a few patches to help this process.

Sorry for the length of this email!
Good Luck Mad Scientists :-)
Brad"

I can't post his mail in its entirety due to not having permission from David Clark to repeat the guide here, but below are Brad's comments/tips he had inserted in the text:

" Transmit works well from: www.panic.com/transmit/download.html ******* or download Quadrivio Edit Lite from: www.quadrivio.com/products.html#QGELite

[in step Step 10:]

Save the file *****(i.e. mach_kernal.new)**** (and ftp it back over to the target drive)
*******This was a little tricky - ftp it back over to the documents folder in DP3 (because it would not let me overwrite the original mach_kernal) then reboot into OS9 on the supported computer. Now change the original to mach_kernal.old and move it to the documents folder then change the name of the hacked mach_kernal.new to just mach_kernal and put in the folder where the original mach_kernal was****** "

More Peek-a-Boo/Performance Comments:

" Hi Mike
I have an PCC PowerTower 180e running 8.6, 128 RAM and Speed Doubler with Emulation only.
Now about Peek-A-Boo. I was running it yesterday after reading the information about certain extensions/apps hogging clicks, and my absolute worst offender is Vicomsoft FTP! It sucks up ticks without even being connected. In fact, I was downloading some MP3's using MT-Newswatcher, and FTP *still* took more ticks sitting in the background doing nothing. FTP is also really "grabby" ie, when dragging files past or into its window, the drag speed really slows down. Maybe the two correlate?

After FTP, AppSwitcher and Control Strip seem like lightweights; I'm not going to eliminate AppSwitcher any time soon though: it's too damn useful!
Dave "

TurboMax IDE Card OK for AV Now in Older Macs? A reader asked if any Turbomax PCI IDE card owners could comment on video capture/playback performance (any stuttering/dropped frames) with the latest cards. I noted in the news some months back when they raised prices the warning on AV performance with pre-Beige G3 Macs is no longer on their TurboMax page. I'm not sure it really is fixed as I don't have the latest firmware but have gotten only one report that I can remember on AV being ok with an older Mac (9600 owner). My TurboMax card still has the original 1.5 ROM installed.

"Is the TurboMax with current firmware considered OK for AV playback on older Macs now?

I couldn't find any hint of the old warnings on the Promax site. At the top of their turbomax page they state:

ProMax PHA-ATA TurboMAX /ATA- Ultra PCI Host Adapter, Cable - G3/G4, 8500, 8600, 9500, 9600

* Burst Rates as high as 33 MB/sec
* For Pre-Press, Graphic Design, and Digital Video Applications

?
-David"

I welcome comments from pre-Beige G3 Mac owners on Turbomax IDE card A/V playback/capture performance (note the ROM version of your card or when it was purchased as well as your Mac model, OS and hard drive brand/size).

Reminder to Update USB Card Drivers: A reader comments about the performance impact of the older USB card drivers compared to later versions (noted here last year):

"Mike,
I wrote a few days ago regarding a performance issue with Apple's PCI->USB Card 1.3.5 extensions.

I contacted Apple's USB team and they told me that 1.3.5 used a polled method and the new version 1.4.1 to be released soon uses an interrupt driven method. The end result with the new drivers is 20% better overall system performance. The MacBench 4 scores for my machine w/1.3.5 extensions was 1250 with the 1.4.1f4 extensions, 1483... nearly 20%! It's not just the benchmark, the machine feels faster too.
Just thought I'd let you know,
-Roland Gustafsson"

B&W G3 Airport 1.1 Base Station Comments: [To clarify questions from readers, Tom is using the software to configure the Airport base station module, not run the B&W G3 as a base station itself. Previous software versions reportedly would not install on non-Airport compatible Macs. ] Tom Koons comments on using the latest Airport software to setup his B&W G3 as a base station and also notes what happens when people have file sharing or permissions set to allow others access to their computers.

"Hi Mike, I just downloaded the latest 1.1 airport software to see if it really would work on a non airport compatible Mac. I tried it on my B&W G3 and below is what I posted on my web site. Pretty scary if you ask me!

Airport 1.1 software download: Here is an Apple TIL to download Airport 1.1 software http://asu.info.apple.com/swupdates.nsf/artnum/n11570

Now here is the cool part! You don't need to have an Airport compatible Mac any more to use the base station. This software package even though Apple lists that you need one of these newer Macs will work on older Macs. You don't need to run the installer to get the software. It is no longer in a Tome. It is in the base station folder and can be ran right from the self mounted disk image. I just tried and it worked for me even though I don't own a base station.

Now for the scary part! I might not own a base station but the software found 5 other base stations on my network! Yes there was even one that had a name of "Cox @ Home"? Not sure if someone named theirs like this or if Cox owns one? Just in case the owners of these are reading this, I was unable to access any of them as they were all passworded out but I wanted you all to know that at least on a cable network they are visible.
Tom"

As I told Tom, I still remember the report I read of a lady in California that just got Cable Net access and when she clicked on Windows' "Network Neighborhood" she saw literally every computer in her real neighborhood who had the service.

Eudora Pro and Yahoo Mail Problems? Update: Glenn Gutierrez wrote that the problems the reader reported today may be temporary:

"Hi Mike,
I'd wager it's a Yahoo problem. It seems to go down constantly, sometimes reporting an error just because nothing is in your inbox. I've sent mail to myself as a fix, then it works fine for hours, or days if you're lucky. Something to try, perhaps?

I've been using Eudora with Yahoo for as long as they've offered POP access. Mostly I receive email, since I use a yahoo.com address to lodge spam complaints (in case of retaliation). So I'm sure POP works.

Just tried sending, to test SMTP, and it works fine as well.
Using Eudora 4.3.1 paid now, but I've been through all the non-beta versions. Probably just a bad coincidence of timing for Mick...
Glenn "

[The original problem post] This reader sent a note that Eudora Pro won't work with Yahoo mail, but Outlook Express does:

"Hi Mike,
I realize this might be off topic but your site is my favorite resource so I'm going to direct there.

My girlfriend uses yahoo email because she uses Internet cafes and does not have her own computer. I have used Eudora Pro for about two years now and have never had a problem until about 3 weeks ago, I have been getting a lot of bounced mail from yahoo pop servers from about 3 weeks ago, my girlfriend uses ICQ as well and tells me she does not get my email and I get sent mail bounced back in my inbox, Internet Gold in israel.

I have been pulling my hair out trying to figure out why and even tried my own test yahoo test account to verify this and it does not get through from my ISP.

Today I installed Outlook Express 5 just for a look at it, being impressed by MicroSofts Mac offerings of late (I just got an Intelli Mouse Explorer and it is by far the best thing I have bought for my Mac in the last year) and I've been using a beta IE 5 and that rocks.

Anyway my email gets through now, I have absolutely no idea why, I did not even touch the preferences for Outlook I just let it import my settings from Eudora 4.3.1 and my email gets through now.

If anybody can give me an idea why I would be very grateful, I have tested it about 10 times now and I get the same result Outlook works and Eudora doesn't.

Thanks for giving the Mac community by far the best resource web site.
Mick Bramley "

If anyone has a fix or workaround for this (assuming it's fixable and not a Yahoo issue) please contact me.

Bottom Line sent their latest list of weekly specials.

The Owner's CPU Upgrade Reviews, Mac Game Reviews and Mac Game/Video card Performance searchable databases were updated last night with new reader reports.

For a blast from the past, see what was on the main news page one year ago today and two years ago.

The recent features page also lists articles posted (most recent first) as does the sidebar links here. The site topics pages (systems, cpu upgrades, etc. - see top and sidebar links on this page) also are places to check as well as the FAQ.

Friday's News Summary

• Mac Game/Video card performance database Powerbook category search bug fixed
• Bottom Line sale on PF G4/350 CPU cards
• Bottom Line relies on Cinema Display Pricing
• Bottom Line $99.99 sale on Turbomax PCI IDE card
• More Info on Cinema Display Dealer Sales
• Adaptec 2906 V1.2 Software fixes G4 Sleep Issues
• Adaptec SlimSCSI 1480 in Pismo Report
• 66GB Mac Tape Drive
• More Extensions Performance Impact Comments
• More Comments on OS 9/Peek-a-Boo/CPU Time/Extensions
• Owner's CPU Upgrade Reviews, Mac Game Reviews and Mac Game/Video card Performance searchable databases updated.
• Other Net News/TIL Updates/Software Updates

Thursday's News Summary

• Bottom Line selling Cinema Displays separately
• More USB Midi Adapter/Apps Reports
• OS 9 Performance Tips
• New Pismo Comments page includes benchmarks
• Cinema Display review updated with another owners comments on bad pixels
• Ram Prices Still Rising (Korea reader's comments)
• OS 9.0.2 solves reader's USB/SCSI adapter problem
• DVD Player 2.1 Comments
• Better Palm Serial Port Monitor Tip
• About USB/Midi Adapter Apps Support
• Owner's CPU Upgrade Reviews and Mac Game/Video card Performance searchable databases were updated last night with new reader reports.
• Other Net News/TIL Updates/Software Updates

Wednesday's News Summary

• 3dfx Online Store
• Ram Prices Rising
• More Pismo owner comments
• OWC 4X SCSI CDR sale
• IDE ORB in G4 Tip
• Pismo Hard Drive Noise
• Game News page updated for Q2 Zoom tip, Game Launcher
• Intech Promises Cure for all B&W Rev 1 HD Data Corruption
• More B&W G3 Rev 1 Drive Reports
• Beige G3/IBM HD Report
• Acer 10X DVD Drive Report
• Screenshot Comparing Voodoo5 AA vs GeForce
• Palm Serial Port Monitor/PB G3 Issues & Workaround
• Midiman 2x2 Sales
• TIL Updates/Other Net News/Software Updates

For links to older news pages see the Archives page.

The recent features page has a lists reviews/articles you may have missed.

For a guide to finding answers to questions - see my Site Guide page.

Considering a CPU Upgrade? Search the CPU Upgrade Owner's Survey results and search for owner reports by Mac model and/or card brand. The current database has more than 3,300+ reports and growing.